So apparently male critics and dudefen in general haaaaaaaaaated this ep, which seems only fair, since my friends and I loved it and I was already feeling strong season 1 vibes for obvious reasons.
In no particular order:
- more people should hug Georgiou - I suspected from the title that we'd have MU shenanigans, but not ... this. Whatever this is - I'm calling bubble universe or simulation, not literal time travel - but I also think that wondering too hard about the logistics and technicalities is missing the point? - the point being, Philippa Georgiou is starting to realise she's in a redemption arc, and she's mad about it - but not so mad she won't try to redeem her Michael - I don't expect, or even want, Jason Isaacs to turn up next week, but at the same time, I'm sort of into how much Lorca is on everyone's lips? - I dunno, I guess I miss that guy - the Tilly/Landry shipper in my life is gonna be SO happy - I am also delighted that the distress signal from the source of the Burn isn't Discovery - but back to the mirror universe - Stamets deserved to die for that "poetry" - you'd think that I would be crying out for Jayne Brook to appear as mirror!Kat ... but you'd be wrong, I have way too much headcanon about that character to lose her to canon now! - (okay, I would find a way to cope if they brought her in) - I love the parallel between Georgiou and Michael in the snow, and the very first scene of the series - I adore how the MU is just women, women, women, and also Saru is there - okay, and Rhys - don't sleep tonight, Rhys - Owo will come for you - and not in a fun way - mirror Lorca is boring in bed: CANON
- don't sleep tonight, Rhys - Owo will come for you - and not in a fun way
lol
- mirror Lorca is boring in bed: CANON
ALSO LOL
You already know how much I loved this one, but I'll say it again: I spent most of the episode wondering how much more delightfully ridiculous it was going to get, and by the time we got to Stamets' poetry and the Terran Cirque du Soleil (still amazed they weren't using actual blades), I basically could not stop laughing. Everything about this episode was batshit, OTT, full-on scenery chewing, and I am ready for more even if it means we're probably saying goodbye to Georgiou next week.
- the point being, Philippa Georgiou is starting to realise she's in a redemption arc, and she's mad about it I loooooooved this dawning revelation and the way it is played. SO GOOD.
So apparently male critics and dudefen in general haaaaaaaaaated this ep, which seems only fair, since my friends and I loved it and I was already feeling strong season 1 vibes for obvious reasons.
Now that's a great recommendation!
(I am so far behind, aaagh. I don't mind being spoiled tho.)
Ofc they hated it. I still have mixed feelings about The Emperor herself but enjoyed the story tremendously once we got the MU. I wish Disco in general would give us more drama and spectacle when we go to some of these different planets.
I mean, it has to be a bubble universe/pocket dimension/something, because we have the preview shots from the next episode where Discovery continues on in the 32ndC unaltered.
I loved it. I was mostly wrong in my predictions, but I loved it, I loved the Doctor Who bullshit that was Carl (and I mean that with all affection), and most of all I love the fact that you can't go home again, even when home is the mirror universe. The weird play was just the cherry on top of the sundae, I love the mirror universe, I love that hanging out with Starfleet types for two years has changed the emperor irrevocably, and I'm just sorry we won't get to see actual mirror Lorca again, I love him most of all.
but I also think that wondering too hard about the logistics and technicalities is missing the point?
Agreed. It's about the characters, just go with it!
the point being, Philippa Georgiou is starting to realise she's in a redemption arc, and she's mad about it
Hahahaha, she so is.
Stamets deserved to die for that "poetry"
Yes.
I love the parallel between Georgiou and Michael in the snow, and the very first scene of the series
YES! That's the first thing I thought of when I saw their footprints in the snow.
I adore how the MU is just women, women, women, and also Saru is there
ME TOO. No doubt why the dudebros hated the episode. But you know what the coolest thing was? I didn't even notice it was all women until the last scene where they arrest Michael. And when I did notice, I thought, "Maybe this is what progress is like." The fact that they were mainly women of color was even better.
- I'm calling bubble universe or simulation, not literal time travel - but I also think that wondering too hard about the logistics and technicalities is missing the point?
It's branching timelines all the way down, I guess.
- the point being, Philippa Georgiou is starting to realise she's in a redemption arc, and she's mad about it - but not so mad she won't try to redeem her Michael
YES YES YES.
She is: A. learning that Her Michael was not the worshipful strong Terran daughter who was traaaaagically corrupted by Lorca, but actually ticked at being in anyone's shadow. B. realizing that she wants Starfleet Michael's emotions in a Terran package. C. SOOOOO INFECTED BY STARFLEET EVEN SECTION 31 AHAHAHAHAHAH D. probably realizing that if she can keep Mirror Saru from freaking out when he goes through his metamorphosis, she gets an assassin who will be overlooked? I mean, she should realize that. Starfleet Saru doesn't have anxiety anymore.
D1. So, the ganglia freakout reaction... Like, both a survival mechanism AND a pre-fighter reflex? Since he throws spines from there when threatened now...
God, Sonequa Martin-Green can act, eh? Her moment in the hallway as mirror Michael was starting to come unhinged was just delightful. Between her and Michelle Yeoh, this episode was a masterclass.
Assuming part 2 holds up, this is on track to be my favorite of the season.
I love this kind of time travel storyline in general and I also love Georgiou, Michael, and their relationship, so I was probably going to like this episode. I was not expecting, before this episode, that we were ever going to actually see mirror Michael, but I like that we're getting to and that her and Georgiou's roles are basically reversed from Georgiou and primeverse Michael. And the part with mirror Stamets and the poetry was hilarious.
(I just wish the Discovery writers would do more of these kinds of character-focused explorations for characters who aren't about to leave sometimes.)
>> I just wish the Discovery writers would do more of these kinds of character-focused explorations for characters who aren't about to leave sometimes.)
Loved it. LOVED IT. Compared to how cohesive the rest of the season has been, it does feel like we've gone off on a two-part sidequest, but I'm absolutely not complaining about it, because WHAT a sidequest. I couldn't have dared to hope this was where this episode would go, and I'm honestly delighted by absolutely every part of what happened behind that door.
I guess some other actual plot stuff also happened this episode, but whatever. Mirrorverse!
I'm still a bit iffy on MU Georgiou and I thought it was kinda fake when Tilly hugged her.
But once they actually got to the MU I loved it. I loved the spectacle and drama of it, makes me miss TOS honestly. I cheered when we finally got to see MU Michael. I think the changes in Georgiou are realistic. I am kinda surprised it was a two-parter since the plot itself doesn't seem like it should need two parts in relationship to the rest of the season but it's Michelle Yeoh and if this is how she ends up leaving she certainly deserves the episode itself to be special and spend a good amount of time on her.
Like others, I think it might be a simulation created based on Georgiou's memories, not reality. Mainly because that was probably the most pathetic assassination attempt ever. If that's what happened MU Michael is sloppy.
Anyway loved the episode overall. Still feel weird about saving space Hitler though.
AHhh look this is basically a laundry list of everything I want. Georgiou-centric, Mirrorverse shenanigans, Georgiou being cranky af about her redemption arc, Mirror Owo, those costumes, Georgiou doing good things and being manipulative and having a Very Good Evil Reason for doing them.
What can I say I am just into a whole episode focusing on my favourite character in the show? I am cheap that way. The only way they could have improved it was if they gave Grudge a cameo.
I have this theory that the mirror universe Section 31 is a subversive pro-democracy and kitten appreciation club. And you can't appreciate kittens without a magnificent catto!
Tilly reaching out to Georgiou is so in character.
Vance is giving such good advice to Saru. I think this is the point where I started to like him. Ah that gorgeous (emotionally chewy) scene in the gym, and a Tilly hug!
I don‘t know what the consensus is on Carl but I guess he‘s a Q. Michael probably is a little jealous of Tilly getting a hug and not her.
So happy to see Killy again! And Commander Landry! Mirror!Owosekun is hitting my fealty kink hard.
Ah I am suffering with Georgiou who has been so changed and is now back. I love the hairbrushing scene with mirror!Saru.
Oooh mirrored intro sequence with upside down numbers.
Killy‘s expressions are so funny, but her gentle smile is chilling.
The firefly story was lovely.
Terran Michael pledging allegiance was such a masterclass in acting.
Poor Landry, back only to die again.
Vaharai, oh Georgiou…reminiscing about Saru is so beautiful. Saru being worried about her having changed is so sweet (also what a gorgeous dress)
Ah it ended how it was clear it would end, though the fighting Kelpians were a surprise.
Oooh and was it all a dream? I really did not remember that she came back through the same door.
Book saving the day. Also Reno!!!
And this time we get a proper goodbye.
Georgiou: I will never find another like you Michael: But we owe it to ourselves to try.
I know the time portal needs to be kept secret and I guess Michael thought Saru would feel compelled to tell Vance in his report. Still, it feels wrong to keep it from him.
Deleted scene: a bar fight, excellent! But on the whole, unnecessary, as were the detailed death of the co conspirators. Still I was happy to get a couple more minutes of Landry.
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timeasmymeasure
no subject
Date: 2020-12-11 01:48 am (UTC)So apparently male critics and dudefen in general haaaaaaaaaated this ep, which seems only fair, since my friends and I loved it and I was already feeling strong season 1 vibes for obvious reasons.
In no particular order:
- more people should hug Georgiou
- I suspected from the title that we'd have MU shenanigans, but not ... this. Whatever this is
- I'm calling bubble universe or simulation, not literal time travel
- but I also think that wondering too hard about the logistics and technicalities is missing the point?
- the point being, Philippa Georgiou is starting to realise she's in a redemption arc, and she's mad about it
- but not so mad she won't try to redeem her Michael
- I don't expect, or even want, Jason Isaacs to turn up next week, but at the same time, I'm sort of into how much Lorca is on everyone's lips?
- I dunno, I guess I miss that guy
- the Tilly/Landry shipper in my life is gonna be SO happy
- I am also delighted that the distress signal from the source of the Burn isn't Discovery
- but back to the mirror universe
- Stamets deserved to die for that "poetry"
- you'd think that I would be crying out for Jayne Brook to appear as mirror!Kat ... but you'd be wrong, I have way too much headcanon about that character to lose her to canon now!
- (okay, I would find a way to cope if they brought her in)
- I love the parallel between Georgiou and Michael in the snow, and the very first scene of the series
- I adore how the MU is just women, women, women, and also Saru is there
- okay, and Rhys
- don't sleep tonight, Rhys
- Owo will come for you
- and not in a fun way
- mirror Lorca is boring in bed: CANON
no subject
Date: 2020-12-11 02:36 am (UTC)- Owo will come for you
- and not in a fun way
lol
- mirror Lorca is boring in bed: CANON
ALSO LOL
You already know how much I loved this one, but I'll say it again: I spent most of the episode wondering how much more delightfully ridiculous it was going to get, and by the time we got to Stamets' poetry and the Terran Cirque du Soleil (still amazed they weren't using actual blades), I basically could not stop laughing. Everything about this episode was batshit, OTT, full-on scenery chewing, and I am ready for more even if it means we're probably saying goodbye to Georgiou next week.
(Also, mirror!Michael's lipstick? *chefkiss*)
no subject
Date: 2020-12-11 03:21 am (UTC)no subject
Date: 2020-12-11 03:38 am (UTC)I loooooooved this dawning revelation and the way it is played. SO GOOD.
no subject
Date: 2020-12-11 04:55 am (UTC)Now that's a great recommendation!
(I am so far behind, aaagh. I don't mind being spoiled tho.)
no subject
Date: 2020-12-11 05:10 pm (UTC)no subject
Date: 2020-12-11 05:05 am (UTC)I loved it. I was mostly wrong in my predictions, but I loved it, I loved the Doctor Who bullshit that was Carl (and I mean that with all affection), and most of all I love the fact that you can't go home again, even when home is the mirror universe. The weird play was just the cherry on top of the sundae, I love the mirror universe, I love that hanging out with Starfleet types for two years has changed the emperor irrevocably, and I'm just sorry we won't get to see actual mirror Lorca again, I love him most of all.
no subject
Date: 2020-12-11 09:47 am (UTC)no subject
Date: 2020-12-13 06:07 pm (UTC)Agreed. It's about the characters, just go with it!
the point being, Philippa Georgiou is starting to realise she's in a redemption arc, and she's mad about it
Hahahaha, she so is.
Stamets deserved to die for that "poetry"
Yes.
I love the parallel between Georgiou and Michael in the snow, and the very first scene of the series
YES! That's the first thing I thought of when I saw their footprints in the snow.
I adore how the MU is just women, women, women, and also Saru is there
ME TOO. No doubt why the dudebros hated the episode. But you know what the coolest thing was? I didn't even notice it was all women until the last scene where they arrest Michael. And when I did notice, I thought, "Maybe this is what progress is like." The fact that they were mainly women of color was even better.
no subject
Date: 2020-12-15 12:00 am (UTC)- but I also think that wondering too hard about the logistics and technicalities is missing the point?
It's branching timelines all the way down, I guess.
- the point being, Philippa Georgiou is starting to realise she's in a redemption arc, and she's mad about it
- but not so mad she won't try to redeem her Michael
YES YES YES.
She is:
A. learning that Her Michael was not the worshipful strong Terran daughter who was traaaaagically corrupted by Lorca, but actually ticked at being in anyone's shadow.
B. realizing that she wants Starfleet Michael's emotions in a Terran package.
C. SOOOOO INFECTED BY STARFLEET EVEN SECTION 31 AHAHAHAHAHAH
D. probably realizing that if she can keep Mirror Saru from freaking out when he goes through his metamorphosis, she gets an assassin who will be overlooked? I mean, she should realize that. Starfleet Saru doesn't have anxiety anymore.
D1. So, the ganglia freakout reaction... Like, both a survival mechanism AND a pre-fighter reflex? Since he throws spines from there when threatened now...
(I LOVE ALL THE FEMALE CHARACTERS.)
no subject
Date: 2025-01-17 08:03 pm (UTC)100%
>> - I love the parallel between Georgiou and Michael in the snow, and the very first scene of the series
YES! So good!
>> - okay, and Rhys
- don't sleep tonight, Rhys
- Owo will come for you
- and not in a fun way
- mirror Lorca is boring in bed: CANON
Thanks for making me laugh.
no subject
Date: 2020-12-11 03:38 am (UTC)God, Sonequa Martin-Green can act, eh? Her moment in the hallway as mirror Michael was starting to come unhinged was just delightful. Between her and Michelle Yeoh, this episode was a masterclass.
no subject
Date: 2020-12-13 06:10 pm (UTC)SO UNHINGED. SO GREAT.
no subject
Date: 2025-01-17 08:06 pm (UTC)no subject
Date: 2020-12-11 03:45 am (UTC)I love this kind of time travel storyline in general and I also love Georgiou, Michael, and their relationship, so I was probably going to like this episode. I was not expecting, before this episode, that we were ever going to actually see mirror Michael, but I like that we're getting to and that her and Georgiou's roles are basically reversed from Georgiou and primeverse Michael. And the part with mirror Stamets and the poetry was hilarious.
(I just wish the Discovery writers would do more of these kinds of character-focused explorations for characters who aren't about to leave sometimes.)
no subject
Date: 2025-01-17 08:08 pm (UTC)Yes
no subject
Date: 2020-12-11 03:57 pm (UTC)I guess some other actual plot stuff also happened this episode, but whatever. Mirrorverse!
no subject
Date: 2020-12-11 05:30 pm (UTC)But once they actually got to the MU I loved it. I loved the spectacle and drama of it, makes me miss TOS honestly. I cheered when we finally got to see MU Michael. I think the changes in Georgiou are realistic. I am kinda surprised it was a two-parter since the plot itself doesn't seem like it should need two parts in relationship to the rest of the season but it's Michelle Yeoh and if this is how she ends up leaving she certainly deserves the episode itself to be special and spend a good amount of time on her.
Like others, I think it might be a simulation created based on Georgiou's memories, not reality. Mainly because that was probably the most pathetic assassination attempt ever. If that's what happened MU Michael is sloppy.
Anyway loved the episode overall. Still feel weird about saving space Hitler though.
no subject
Date: 2025-01-17 08:08 pm (UTC)Absolutely,
no subject
Date: 2020-12-13 12:54 am (UTC)AHhh look this is basically a laundry list of everything I want. Georgiou-centric, Mirrorverse shenanigans, Georgiou being cranky af about her redemption arc, Mirror Owo, those costumes, Georgiou doing good things and being manipulative and having a Very Good Evil Reason for doing them.
What can I say I am just into a whole episode focusing on my favourite character in the show? I am cheap that way. The only way they could have improved it was if they gave Grudge a cameo.
no subject
Date: 2020-12-13 01:09 am (UTC)no subject
Date: 2020-12-13 01:14 am (UTC)Or...Mirror Grudge. Can you imagine an evil counterpart for Grudge?
no subject
Date: 2020-12-13 01:20 am (UTC)no subject
Date: 2020-12-13 05:43 am (UTC)A Bobcat or other wild cat, maybe?
Or just invert it, and have mirror Grudge by a tiny kitten!
no subject
Date: 2020-12-15 12:04 am (UTC)no subject
Date: 2025-01-17 08:13 pm (UTC)no subject
Date: 2025-01-17 09:58 pm (UTC)no subject
Date: 2020-12-13 06:13 pm (UTC)no subject
Date: 2025-01-17 08:01 pm (UTC)Vance is giving such good advice to Saru. I think this is the point where I started to like him.
Ah that gorgeous (emotionally chewy) scene in the gym, and a Tilly hug!
I don‘t know what the consensus is on Carl but I guess he‘s a Q. Michael probably is a little jealous of Tilly getting a hug and not her.
So happy to see Killy again! And Commander Landry! Mirror!Owosekun is hitting my fealty kink hard.
Ah I am suffering with Georgiou who has been so changed and is now back. I love the hairbrushing scene with mirror!Saru.
Terra Firma 2 - spoilers!
Date: 2025-01-20 07:46 pm (UTC)Georgiou: I will never find another like you
Michael: But we owe it to ourselves to try.
I know the time portal needs to be kept secret and I guess Michael thought Saru would feel compelled to tell Vance in his report. Still, it feels wrong to keep it from him.
Deleted scene: a bar fight, excellent! But on the whole, unnecessary, as were the detailed death of the co conspirators. Still I was happy to get a couple more minutes of Landry.